Intel Graphics and the quest to support DP 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 Adapters

[SReis]

Hello Intel,

As you might have picked up, there has been a surge of interest for using ParadeTech's interface converter with Intel Graphics. For many, the primary goal has been around connecting various Intel Graphics iterations with recently released adapters to convert DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 allowing for 4kp60 access on 4kTV's. Given that 99% of 4kTV's today only support HDMI and not DisplayPort, use of this adapter is critical for HTPC usage, allowing users to fully leverage their Intel Graphics. Please see the following links for information regarding the underlying chip technology and subsequent adapters released to the consumer market:

Paradetech PS175 & 176:

http://www.paradetech.com/products/displayport-format-converters/ps175/ http://www.paradetech.com/products/displayport-format-converters/ps175/

http://www.paradetech.com/products/displayport-format-converters/ps176/ http://www.paradetech.com/products/displayport-format-converters/ps176/

Club 3D's CAC-1070 and CAC-1170 Consumer DP 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapters:

http://www.club-3d.com/index.php/products/reader.en/product/displayport-12-to-hdmi-20-uhd-active-adapter.html DisplayPort™ 1.2 to HDMI™ 2.0 4K60Hz UHD Active Adapter

http://www.club-3d.com/index.php/products/reader.en/product/mini-displayport-12-to-hdmi-20-uhd-active-adapter.html Mini DisplayPort™ 1.2 to HDMI™ 2.0 4K60Hz UHD Active Adapter

Many are discovering that when attempting to use the above adapter with Intel Graphics (that support 4kp60 via DisplayPort) only 4kp30 becomes available in the Intel Graphics drivers. This is accounting for the 4kTV with native support for 4kp60 4:4:4 and using High-Speed HDMI cables. For example, using the adapter with my Intel NUC5i5RYH with Intel Graphics 6000 connected to my Samsung JS8500 4kTV, (with using all the correct settings) the drivers only allow for 4kp30. This is using the latest Intel beta drivers for Window 10. Some have linked the issue to the inability to change the color depth to 8bit. Is this setting unavailable to us?

It's our understanding the Club 3D may be in touch with you regarding this issue. Can you please confirm if this is the case and let us know if progress is being made? Much of the feedback for the adapter lives in the Clud 3d forum, thread below:

http://insights.club-3d.com/thread/cac-1070-and-1170-hdmi-2-0-adapter-feedback-topic/ CAC-1070 and 1170 HDMI 2.0 adapter feedback topic. | Club 3D Insights

Contact for Club 3D is Marcel van Steijn: mailto:Support@club-3d.com Support@club-3d.com

Marcel has been very helpful trying to assist users with Intel Graphics.

Would love nothing more that to view my NUC wit...

[SReis]

Corresponding Club 3D thread started here:

http://insights.club-3d.com/thread/club-3d-intel-lets-sort-out-issues-with-intel-graphics-and-cac-1070-1170/ Club 3D & Intel: Lets sort out issues with Intel Graphics and CAC-1070 /1170! | Club 3D Insights

[SReis]

Hello Team Intel!

If you see the corresponding Club 3D thread above, Club 3D Technical Support Team is more than happy to work you! Happy to provide a sample for testing, logs, anything you need.

Thanks!

[NWagn2]

I would also love it if Intel could collaborate with Club3D on this. I got one of their DP to HDMI 2.0 adapters, and even after a firmware update wasn't able to achieve anything greater than 30hz above 1920x1080. I got the firmware update, which didn't make a difference, and was already at the latest driver for my HD4600 (driver hadn't been updated since November '15). I tested another PC with an HD4600 with the same results, though I was able to get an HD5500 to work.

I don't know whether it's an issue with the adapter or the Intel driver, but I've got to assume it's at least a little of both. I reached out to Club3D's support and though they were very friendly, they weren't able to offer any advice besides checking my cables and changing color depth. By the way, 32/16/8bit on the Intel Control Panel correlates to 12/10/8bpc that everyone else references, though in my case all it did was make my colors look pretty wacky.

[AClar11]

I did a topic on this several weeks back and made no progress unfortunately:

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Hello, onizuka:

There is a feature in DP that would allow the 4k at 60Hz, which is called Multi-Stream Transport, I could tell that HDMI 2.0 doesn't support that due to the fact you are not getting full Hz from that interface.

I regret to inform you that this is more like an limitation from the adapter/interface that would be leading to the behavior of the system.

Right now, there is no information about Intel working with the company mentioned previously.

Some additional information that could help: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI# Version_1.4 HDMI - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DisplayPort DisplayPort - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Regards,

Esteban C

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Also, I would like you to check if in the config for your TV, you have switch modes to be available, this is the capacity of the receiver to allow how the signal is received.

Please do check that the port used in your TV is indeed HDMI 2.0

May I also have the maker and model of your TV?

Regards,

Esteban C

[NWagn2]

Yep, I replied with the hopes of getting someone from Intel to comment, but we see how well that went.

[NWagn2]

MST in DisplayPort is not required for a 4K display. Although early 4K monitors did use it in order to bypass the inability of a variety of interfaces to produce a 4K @ 60hz image, and while MST was a clever way to get it to work right, it presented a number of usability issues. "Modern" displays do not require MST, and it stands to reason that the current crop of DisplayPort 1.2 to HDMI 2.0 adapters does not utilize it either. It is not mentioned in the material for the chipset, nor is it mentioned as a requirement in the adapter documentation, so it seems safe to presume that it utilizes SST (single stream transport) instead.

Anyway, I did some digging around and found this thread:

/message/255848?tstart=0# 255848 https://communities.intel.com/message/255848?tstart=0# 255848

Robert_U mentions that getting the full 60hz will require a dot clock of 536MHz, which in turn requires a 540MHz CDCLK (core display clock), which depending on the processor will be limited. This is the reason why the U processors only support 30hz, and possibly an OEM trying to save some power, will be unable to drive at the full 60hz.

However, with that in mind my own board is an Intel DH87RL with an 4570S, so if anyone would know that it's being limited, it would indeed be Intel. I'd be curious how to expose this value, since then I would at least be able to rule that out as an issue. According to CPUz the GPU clock is running at 350MHz, and while I don't mind trying to overclock that a smidge to test, I don't believe that it is the same value to target.

Either way, here is the information from the card, which suggests that the 3840x2160 @ 60hz should be exposed to be selected, but isn't available in the Intel control panel:

Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600

Report Date: Friday, January 15, 2016

Report Time [hh:mm:ss]: 6:37:37 PM

Driver Version: 10.18.14.4332

Operating System: Windows* 7 Professional (6.1.7601)

Default Language: English (United States)

Physical Memory: 7113 MB

Vendor ID: 8086

Device ID: 0412

Device Revision: 06

Video BIOS: 2179.0

Current Resolution: 3840 x 2160

Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-4570S CPU @ 2.90GHz

Processor Speed: 2893 MHz

Processor Graphics in Use: Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600

Shader Version: 5.0

OpenCL* Version: 1.2

* Microsoft DirectX* *

Runtime Version: 11.0

Hardware-Supported Version: 11.0

* Devices connected to the Graphics Accelerator *

Active Displays: 1

* Digital Television *

Display Type: Digital

DDC2 Protocol: Supported

Gamma: 2.2

Connector Type: DisplayPort

Device Type: Digital Television

Maximum Image Size

Horizontal Size: 73.62 inches

Vertical Size: 41.34 inches

Supported Modes

640 x 480 (60p Hz)

640 x 480 (75p Hz)

720 x 400 (70p Hz)

720 x 480 (60p Hz)

720 x 576 (50p Hz)

720 x 576 (50i Hz)

800 x 600 (60p Hz)

800 x 600 (72p Hz)

800 x 600 (75p Hz)

1024 x 768 (60p Hz)

1024 x 768 (70p Hz)

1024 x 768 (75p Hz)

1280 x 720 (50p Hz)

1280 x 720 (60p Hz)

1920 x 1080 (24p Hz)

1920 x 1080 (60i Hz)

1920 x 1080 (50i Hz)

1920 x 1080 (50p Hz)

1920 x 1080 (60p Hz)

3840 x 2160 (25p Hz)

3840 x 2160 (60p Hz)

3840 x 2160 (30p Hz)

3840 x 2160 (24p Hz)

Raw EDID:

00 FF FF FF FF FF FF 00 4D 10 12 11 01 01 01 01

0F 19 01 03 80 BB 69 78 0A 64 FD AE 4F 41 B2 26

0D 47 4A A5 CE 00 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01

01 01 01 01 01 01 08 E8 00 30 F2 70 5A 80 B0 58

8A 00 94 24 53 00 00 1E 00 00 00 FD 00 32 4D 1F

46 3C 00 0A 20 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 FF 00 34

30 31 42 30 37 31 31 31 31 32 0D 0A 00 00 00 FC

00 4C 43 2D 36 35 55 42 33 30 55 0A 20 20 01 93

02 03 33 71 4F 5F 03 04 05 10 20 15 12 13 14 1F

5D 5E 01 60 29 09 07 05 15 57 50 00 07 00 83 01

00 00 6D 03 0C 00 40 00 28 76 20 00 60 01 02 03

E2 0E 61 08 E8 00 30 F2 70 5A 80 B0 58 8A 00 94

24 53 00 00 1E 02 3A 80 18 71 38 2D 40 58 2C 45

00 94 24 53 00 00 1E 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00

00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00

00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 3B

[SReis]

Hi Esteban,

For my specific scenario, I'm using a JS8500FXZA. I'm setting UHD Color mode and well as setting the input to PC. For the HDMI cable I've tested both these two high-speed cables:

http://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=10764 Ultra Slim 18Gbps Active High Speed HDMI® Cable with RedMere® Technology, 3ft Black - Monoprice.com

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B014I8T4MO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B014I8T4MO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage

I don't believe MST would be a factor for either the DP output on the Broadwell NUC or the Club 3D adapter.

I've asked the folks over the Club 3D to join this thread so we can narrow down the exact requirements between the recent iterations of Intel Graphics (e.g. integrated graphics associated with Haswell to Skylake). See if we can determine which iteration should be supported, and what exact settings are required to accomplish it. This would allow end users to determine if the have an Intel Graphics that qualify. Thanks.

[NWagn2]

I've got to say, I'm really disappointed by the lack of participation by Intel in this thread. I'm not very surprised that Club3D hasn't joined in, but I figured someone from the Intel community would try to chime in more than just once.

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Hello, All:

Thank you for the information provided about this scenario.

I will be sending this for review, I will be providing you with my outcome on this.

Regards,

Esteban C

[NWagn2]

Thank you for the update Esteban, I sincerely look forward to hearing what resolution there may be.

On a somewhat related note, are there plans to update the current HD4600 driver for Windows 7? There appear to be beta drivers in place for this device, but only supporting Windows 8 and 10.

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Hello, Some_Guy:

No problem, I will keep you posted on this inquiry about the adapter.

I cannot assure that Intel is going to release newer drivers for Windows 7* due to the fact that 2 newer versions of the OS have been out for a while now.

Regards,

Esteban C

[MM16]

Hi @NWagn2 , I don't find mentionings online of if Intel do MST at all really. I posted a fresh question about MST via two Displayport cables to drive an 8K@60Hz display here https://forums.intel.com/s/question/0D50P00004NfPBoSAN/which-intel-hd-gpu-models-support-8k-monitor-eg-dell-up3218k-via-dualdisplayport-14-cable , any insights would be much appreciated, thanks!

[ASarm2]

I was able to get the CAC-1170 to put out 3840x2160 @ 60Hz from Intel HD Graphics 4600 using the instructions in this video: https://youtu.be/1fhmwuLQCxw https://youtu.be/1fhmwuLQCxw. Using the latest Intel graphics driver (15.40.18.4380, doesn't need to be the beta) you make a custom resolution for 3840x2160@60 Hz and use the CVT-RB timing standard instead of GTF. Then go back to the General Settings and 60p should be an option under Refresh Rate. Color stays at 32 bit. Tested with both regular use and a bunch of videos and everything is working fine so far (Big Buck Bunny 3840x2160 60fps was buttery smooth: http://bbb3d.renderfarming.net/download.html Big Buck Bunny 3D - Download). HD Graphics 4600 only has H.264 and HEVC 8-bit hardware acceleration (no VP9 or HEVC 10-bit) so 2160p60 videos on youtube and 2160p 60fps 10-bit x265 videos were stuttering pretty badly for me (with CPU @ 100%).

On a side note, why is the default for Intel Graphics to use the old GTF timing standard instead of the newer CVT/CVT-RB standard? Couldn't the software at least pick the timing standard based on the EDID from the display rather than requiring a custom resolution to use the newer standard? EstebanC_Intel, maybe you could communicate that to your developers and let them know it would save many users from the hassle of hunting down this work-around?

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Hello, arupman:

Thank you for the workaround on this scenario.

I will be adding this for review as well.

Really appreciate your contribution on this, if other users are able to get the 60Hz with this, please do let us know.

Regards,

Esteban C

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

arupman This is to update you on this, we are currently working on your case with the adapters and 4k at 60hz that is a facts.

As soon as we get the results from this, I will let you know for sure.

Regards,

Esteban C

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Hello, All:

This is to inform you that we are handling this case, getting the adapters and perform tests on our end, its still in process, as soon as we get the results, we'll let you know.

Regards,

Esteban C

[hubick]

I've already returned the NUC6i5SYK I purchased, partly because of this, so it's nice to hear Intel is looking into that.

If anyone figures out how to get this working under Linux (custom modelines I assume), please post that information as well.

I was thinking of trying a NUC6i7KYK for the HDMI 2.0 port, though I imagine this is also needed if you wish to use an adapter with the DP port on that as well.

[EstebanA_C_Intel]

Actually there is a Communities support for Linux and Intel® HD Graphics hubick, here I add some additional information about this.

Intel has a special website where we put all together open source work that Intel engineers are involved in. https://01.org/

Intel does provide development drivers for Intel® graphics to the open source community. These development drivers are intended to provide the Linux developer community with an opportunity to provide feedback on the driver and participate in its development. Most versions of the Linux* operating system include Intel® graphics drivers. Intel recommends checking with your Linux distribution vendor for precompiled driver packages.

Development driver source code can be obtained from public repositories found in the Downloads section of the Linux and Intel graphics website.

https://01.org/linuxgraphics/downloads

Development driver support is only available through the open source community. See the Community section of the Linux and Intel graphics website.

https://01.org/linuxgraphics/community

Intel Linux graphics is an open source project where all of our development is done in the open in our mailing lists and public git repositories. We encourage you to participate in this Intel® Graphics for Linux* Project.

https://01.org/linuxgraphics

Still handling the adapter thing, I will you know once performed the tests.

Regards,

Esteban C