11 Replies Latest reply on Aug 21, 2014 2:57 AM by SpiderKenny

    Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE

    Blackcode

      Windows is now free for all of us to test and install on Galileo. Microsoft made us a nice gift.

      For real, this is the best thing I have tested in years. Easy to use, code, connect to. Is still in his early stages but it's far more better and stable.

       

      Here are the Instructions on how to install windows on your Galileo.

       

      Updating your Intel Galileo

        • 1. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
          SpiderKenny

          It's interesting that you think Windows will be better and more stable.

          From Microsoft's document "Windows will take about 2 minutes to boot" - you have to laugh out loud really. What on earth is it doing for that time?

          My Galileo Gen1 with Intel's IoT Linux distro on it boots in about 15 seconds.

           

          Also interesting that you think it'll be easier to connect to and program for - well, only if you are already familiar with Windows and not linux. The exact opposite is true for anyone who is familiar with Linux and not windows.

           

          I have much experience with both, having been with Windows since the early days of MS-DOS's "Shell" command, through Windows 1, WIndows 2, Windows 386.....and so on.

          If past experience is anything to go by we will be entering a world of Driver madness, constant update cycles, security vulnerabilities and random crashes.

          • 2. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
            flummer

            As I see it, its "welcome windows" but not quite buy buy to linux.

             

            It's a new tool that makes it possible to do development in Visual Studio in a very integrated way, with features not present in the Arduino IDE (e.g. debugging and way better editor), but it won't be the answer to all questions.

             

            I'm looking forward to try it out in a few days when my 16GB micro SD card arrives ;-)

             

            /Thomas

            • 3. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
              Eliot

              15 seconds? My Linux BSP image on the SD card takes 45 seconds. Which is FOREVER. I've even eliminated networking. From the serial console output it appears to take 15-20 seconds just to do the POST and hit the bootloader.

              • 4. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                SpiderKenny
                15 seconds?

                 

                Yip.

                • 5. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                  AlexanderMerz

                  There is no need for a 16 GB MicroSD card at the beginning. The Windows base installation is about 600 MB. What will require space is the page file (some kind of cache file as I understood ). After a day of playing and writing some small programs, the file is about 1.3 GB. So you could try a 4 GB card.

                  • 6. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                    AlexanderMerz

                    To be honest: The integration between the Galileo Board and Visual Source is awesome. They communicate over the network, so no need for an - always to short - USB cable.

                    You get line-by-line-debugging out of the box. You can access the whole file system on the Galileo via FTP out-of-the-box.

                     

                    What is good: After booting, the performance seems ok, at least the system is not slower with Windows then Linux.
                    The Windows Arduino-compatibility layer supports pulseIn()! But still no luck with an HCSR04 ultrasonic sensor. The data isn't reliable, because Windows operates with a 16ms tick resolution, to long for the sensor signal.

                     

                    What is bad&ugly: Yes, driver madness. No WLAN/Bluetooth/Cam support without special drivers - and Microsoft doesn't tell you which drivers from which Windows version will work. (But fun fact: the Drivers directory contains a driver for floppydisk drives).

                    And: No programs. Yes, really, aside from some network related tools and the build-in DOS commands, there are no programs, not even a powershell or VBScript interpreter.

                     

                    About the constant update cycles, security vulnerabilities and random crashes

                    Just ask users of DSL routers running on Linux about the update cycles, security vulnerabilies and random crashes, be prepared for longer talks

                    • 7. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                      flummer

                      I got a 16GB card today and had it up and running just minutes ago.

                       

                      When I first booted it up, I had the serial console cable connected to follow along and a lot of text scrolled by, but it never showed up in the Galileo Watcher. I did a few restarts, but it sort of stopped in the boot process. I then disconnected the serial cable and soon after it showed up in the watcher and connection was established. I ran the sample blink sketch/app and could see the debug output, but no led blinking, until I plugged one into pin header 13. Isn't the internal test LED wired up to pin 13 or does it have it's own output?

                       

                      /Thomas

                      • 8. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                        AlexanderMerz

                        AFAIK: The internal LED isn't hardwired to pin 13.

                        • 9. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                          flummer

                          There was a constant that was named something like LED_BUILTIN that showed up in the code completion in VS, but it didn't seem to work either... (compiled OK, but no blinking). I will need to dig in deeper to find out.

                           

                          /Thomas

                          • 10. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                            SpiderKenny
                            They communicate over the network, so no need for an - always to short - USB cable.

                            Same with linux - can't remember the last time I plugged in my USB or Serial cables.

                            You get line-by-line-debugging out of the box. You can access the whole file system on the Galileo via FTP out-of-the-box.

                            Same with linux, but you can also use SCP. Also it's SSH instead of (as well as) telnet for  Linux, so it's more secure.

                            After booting, the performance seems ok, at least the system is not slower with Windows then Linux.

                            I disagree - i) a simple directory listing (dir) scrolls up the screen line by line, compared to linux which just appears. ii)Boot times are not acceptable for embedded device. 2 Minutes to start up! And about the same to shutdown again! What on earth is it doing?


                            What on earth is all that access to the SD Card about, under Windows? What is it doing? Is it reducing the life of my card, I think so!

                             

                            The data isn't reliable, because Windows operates with a 16ms tick resolution, to long for the sensor signal.

                            Nothing to do with windows tick counter, that is just a feature of windows, and nothing to do with IO Speed. The IO speed is non-deterministic no matter what operating system you run.


                            I'm going to be doing some side by side comparisons over the next few days and will write them up for all to see.


                            The BIG difference for me is that to run windows on Galileo you need a proprietary operating system on a host PC, and windows is not cheap. You also need a proprietary IDE and debugger. This is the difference between open source and proprietary systems. You'll never get the source code to Windows nor the IDE (Visual Studio). You cannot write programs on the device itself, you must use a host PC and transfer them over.


                            Then, there is no native support for IO, SPI, or I2C you have to use their 'Arduino' headers and libraries. Yeuch.


                            Finally, just a personal gripe, why does Visual Studio 2013 have to SHOUT AT ME with it's ALL CAPS user interface? Yeuch!




                            • 11. Re: Welcome Windows ...bye bye LINUX - LIVE
                              SpiderKenny

                              I found that the instructions from MS won't work with anything smaller than a 16GB card, they will refuse to burn to an 8GB or smaller.

                              Plus, come on MS, a pagefile on SD Card - are you kidding me? Better buy a big stock of cards and make regular backups.