5 Replies Latest reply on Jun 20, 2011 2:16 PM by parsec

    510 serie 120gb SSD not supported by Intel SSD Toolbox ??

    Dariel

      Hi Everyone,

       

      I will try to make it simple as I spent my whole friday night and whole saturday today on this issue. I just bought the 120Gb version of 510 SSD serie, it is not supported by intel SSD toolbox.

       

      Of the three Intel SSD Management Tools the system Configuration Tuner seems the only one working. This is quite surprising, as I actually picked an Intel SSD for this suite of tools, to ensure Trim while using XP Pro SP3.

       

      Intel SSD toolbox does not support my 510 120gb.JPG

       

      Here are the hardware details :

      • Windows XP Pro 32 Bit
      • Asus A8n32 SLI Deluxe latest bios (Nforce4 SLI)
      • Athlon X2 4200
      • Controller Board Asus U3S6 (revision 0, the first version) PCI-E 4X for USB3 and SATA 6Gb
      • The Intel SSD 510 serie 120gb is connected to the Asus U3S6 Sata3/USB3 controller board. It uses the Marvell 9123 SATA3 Chip
      • I tried to attach the SSD to a Nforce 4 SLI SATA1 connector, Silicon Image SATA1 Connector, Silicon Image eSata2 Connector, and finally the Marvell 9123 of the Asus U3S6...nothing makes the SSD Toolbox to support the 510 Drive for Trim (Intel SSD Optimizer)

         

        I have spent the whole day looking for info, found some, and did the following things

        1. Updated the Marvell 9123 drivers the U3S6 Asus Board uses (1.0.0.1036, because the latest 1.2.0.1003 WHQL are not working, despite the WHQL)
        2. Flashed the firmware of the 9123 controller, to the the latest available : 1.0.0.1028 available on http://www.station-drivers.com/page/marvell.htm

         

        Nothing is working. I found some topics telling Marvell Microcontroller 91xx don't forward Intel TRIM Instruction, hence the Toolbox incapable to launch the SSD Optimizer. But what worries me the most is that the third tool "Secure Erase" cannot work as well (even when the SSD has no partition), so it seems that the toolbox just does not support the intel 510 series yet...how's that possible?

         

        I also found testimonies of people using Seven, and having trouble with the Trim fonction when 510 SSD is paired with Marvell Microcontrolers.

         

        I wanted to transfer my system drive, and old 74Gb raptor, to this 510 (Hefty price by the way), but definitely won't since there is no possibility to lauch manual Trim from time to time.

         

        If an Intel expert passes by...his comments on this issues are welcomed ! And even if you are no Intel engineer, any help is welcomed as well !

         

        Thanks by advance.

         

        Dariel

          • 1. Re: 510 serie 120gb SSD not supported by Intel SSD Toolbox ??
            parsec

            Dariel,  It does not take an Intel Engineer to figure out your problem.  First, one word of advice:  Generalizations/Blanket statements about anything to do with PCs will usually be wrong, since the almost infinite combinations of possibilities that are the nature of computers lead to exceptions in both directions (it works - it doesn't work.)

             

            I have an Intel 510 SSD, just got it two days ago.  I have other Intel SSDs, and so have the Intel SSD Toolbox.  I ran everything but the Full Diagnostic Scan on my 510, and it all worked just fine.  Also, the Acronis/Intel software for cloning an old drive to the new one worked flawlessly, my compliments to those involved.

             

            I must say that you were caught by the generic, only one error message implementation of the SSD Toolbox.  Regardless of the problem, that is the message you will see.  Yes there is an error, but the description has nothing to do with the problem.

             

            You also did discover your problem, the Toolbox Optimizer won't work with the Marvell chipset.  Unless your mother board, etc, uses Intel chipsets, the chances of it working are small, possible, but small.  Apparently a few earlier AMD chipset will work with it, but personally I would not depend on any non-Intel chipset to work with the Optimizer.  Your mother board, being as non-Intel as any I have ever heard of, has virtually no chance of running the Optimizer, or the other tools.  You may get lucky with another option, but the Optimizer is the one most likely not to work.  And yes, I have PCs with Intel chipsets, several different ones, and the Toolbox Optimizer works fine on each of them.

             

            Regrettably, the documentation for the Toolbox does not discuss any of this.  Since there are exceptions, and driver changes apparently have the potential to allow the Optimizer to work, those details may be left out for that reason, but that is pure speculation on my part.

             

            What can you do about it with your current hardware?  Likely nothing, sorry to say

            .

            • 2. Re: 510 serie 120gb SSD not supported by Intel SSD Toolbox ??

              Thanks parsec, for your reply.

               

              I would have hoped a hotfix could exist or something. Without Trim, it is just impossible to use a SSD, I am appaled that Intel doesn't document this Issue under the "known issue" disclaimer.

               

              I could formulate the hypothesis that it has to do with the special protocol of the SSD optimizer, which could be no normal Trim, but I am so disappointed not being able to use the SSD with a SATA6gb controller...At least Intel could sell some Sata 6gb controller cards.

               

              Another question : If, as you say I am doomed since I do not plan to change hardware until end of the year, could the problem be solved using Seven? Is the Trim method of Seven different of the one of Intel? If so, I could still use my product without buying sandy bridge...

               

              So, am I to understand that intel Toolbox nearly only works with intel chipsets?? This clearly sucks, and this clearly not discaimed anywhere. And since it is not possible to use the SSD without Trim...we are really close to a legal case. We are either forced to buy seven (if it trim works while paired with non intel chipset), or buy Intel chipset.

               

              I'll wait a little more, until I decide what to do.

              • 3. Re: 510 serie 120gb SSD not supported by Intel SSD Toolbox ??
                parsec

                To answer your question about Win 7, yes it has TRIM, which actually is a feature of the SATA protocol and was designed and specified by the those that create those specifications.  TRIM exists because the standard PC file systems were designed with regular HDDs in mind, and SSDs function differently.  A file system designed for SSDs does not yet exist.

                 

                Windows 7 may not cure your lack of TRIM problem.  The driver providing TRIM in Win 7, msahci, will only be loaded if you set your SATA mode to AHCI in your BIOS when you install Win 7, or using a registry hack later if you don't install 7 in AHCI mode.  The potential problem is will your SATA controllers function with the Win 7 AHCI driver.  They might, but I can't answer that question since I have no experience with them.

                • 4. Re: 510 serie 120gb SSD not supported by Intel SSD Toolbox ??

                  Thanks Parsec.

                   

                  AHCI specification are for SATA2 and beyond, as I suspect. I don't have any option in my bios concernant AHCI mode or IDE mode for my SATA ports on my MB. The U3S6 is working by default in an AHCI mode called "PassThru AHCI".

                   

                  I still think that the advertisement of Intel bringing Trim under XP and vista should be heavily asterisked and disclaimed "With intel chipset only"...or "list of compatible sata controllers"...I tried SATA 1,5gb, 3gb, 6gb controllers, all being non-intel, not a single combination I tried is working with the SSD toolbox trim function.

                   

                  In the same time, I can't see Intel developping a tool making customer able to use other products by itself...Too bad, it could greatly help the sales of 510 SSDs.

                   

                  Disappointing...

                   

                  Intel SSD cannot support trim when paired with non-intel SATA controllers...

                   

                  By the way, is there another tool that could Trim my SSD and be an alternative to Intel SSD toolbox trim function?

                   

                  Thanks for your help

                  • 5. Re: 510 serie 120gb SSD not supported by Intel SSD Toolbox ??
                    parsec

                    "By the way, is there another tool that could Trim my SSD and be an alternative to Intel SSD toolbox trim function?"

                     

                    You are welcome, and that is a good question, if I had an answer for you it would have been rather rude of me not to offer it to you, IMO.

                     

                    I am not aware of any other program that offers a manual TRIM function, although I have not needed one since I am able to use the Toolbox's Optimizer, as well as use Windows 7 in SATA AHCI mode, and the Intel iaStor (RAID) driver, but do not have SSD's in a RAID array.  I do a fair amount of reading on PC hardware review web sites and forums, and have never heard of any other TRIM utility program, sorry to say.  That does not mean it doesn't exist of course, and it surprises me that no one seems to have created one, other than Intel.  I am not familiar with the offerings of other SSD manufactures, which may be a source of such a tool.

                     

                    Frankly, regarding the use of the Windows msahci driver, I am uncertain that it must be used in AHCI mode (it won't install automatically unless the SATA mode is AHCI), since there are forum members that I think have said TRIM works in IDE mode, but I become confused with the details and conflicting information that I have seen.  I also do not have much experience with SATA controllers beyond those found on Intel chipset based mother boards.  Hopefully someone else may add some information to this thread that could help you.

                     

                    I'm also surprised by the lack of information or caveats regarding the Toolbox and it's usage with various hardware.  The Toolbox User Guide Requirements section is minimal, and mentions only a few very specific hardware restrictions or failures.  I wonder if their is some legal issue behind that.  One thing that is mentioned is the need of Microsoft's .NET Framework software, which is supposed to be automatically installed if not present when the Toolbox is installed.  You might want to verify that you have that installed on your PC, although I cannot guaranteed that it will fix your problem at all, just a thought.